(If you're new, check the top of this post for an explanation of these news wraps.)
Before we dive in, make sure you check out the new wallpapers that Dariusz dropped yesterday. Over the next few days he'll be adding more until we end up with desktop freshness for every player on the team. Hoo-rah!
- David West: Dark | Light
- James Posey: Dark | Light
- Ryan Bowen: Dark | Light
- Devin Brown: Dark | Light
A.M. Updates:
Three reasons we lost this game: turnovers, shooting, and officiating.
Let's start with turnovers. Chris Paul was way out of control, making horrible decisions all night, and throwing awful passes. In short, this was the worst game he's played as a point guard in a long while. Couple that with the various freebie shots he missed, and he really didn't provide much to the Hornets. The rest of the team didn't help him out on the ball-control front. David West turned into a black hole offensively; literally every time he passed out of the post, it resulted in a turnover. The Hornets finished in the neighborhood of a 20% turnover rate, meaning they gave the ball away once every five possessions. On the road, that won't get it done...
There's no way around it; the officiating was very, very, very bad tonight. I'm probably going to put up a video of all the phantom calls that went Denver's way. Off the top of my head, I can think of at least ten. It's ironic that Denver blogs were anticipating superstar calls going Chris Paul's way prior to the series, and Chauncey Billups was the recipient of at least three superstar calls in this game. Dahntay Jones drew two "charges" with his feet clearly moving. J.R. Smith got one of those. Nene travelled three times in the first quarter and was whistled once. Chauncey stiff armed Rasual Butler and drew a blocking foul. The amazing thing was the consistency with which the calls went Denver's way and how widespread they were. They occurred at all points in the game, whether it was West getting called for a "charge" with the Hornets trailing 25 or Butler getting called for a "block" in a tie game.
Although a few of the details changed from Sunday’s Game 1, the script was painfully similar for the Hornets tonight: after scratching and clawing just to stay within striking distance early, New Orleans was on the wrong end of a second-half Denver surge that enabled the spirited, fast-breaking Nuggets to take control. The end result was a second straight one-sided road defeat.
Seventy-two hours after losing by a 29-point margin, the Hornets fell behind by 20-plus points in the fourth quarter and were beaten by 15...
Chauncey Billups didn’t follow up his eight-trey performance in Game 1 with a similar long-range barrage, but he didn’t need to, because he beat the Hornets from just about everywhere else on the floor. Billups did sink four more three-pointers in Game 2, but he also went 11-for-11 from the foul line and piled up 31 points. He averaged 33.5 points in these two games, nearly doubling his 2008-09 regular season average of 17.7.
The Nuggets again demonstrated their superiority in athleticism and quickness over the Hornets when they were able to create turnovers and push the tempo in the second half. Denver took advantage of a third-quarter stretch when New Orleans missed 14 of its initial 17 shots to take command after leading 52-44 at halftime. It again appeared as though New Orleans’ best hope of posting a road victory in this series will be to try to make it a slow-paced, walk-it-up game so that Denver cannot go on one of its patented game-changing runs...
New Orleans also needs to take much better care of the ball. Its 17 turnovers were a big factor behind Denver’s ability to build and expand its lead.
Jeremy Wagner, Roundball Mining Company:
Tonight the Nuggets actually implemented four different schemes, at least that I recognized, to slow down Chris Paul. During game one they brought help on both sides of the screen in order to keep Chris Paul out of the lane. Tonight, they ran much less of that while they did a lot more switching, they also trapped and they even played some straight up hedge and recover.
No matter what scheme they followed Paul was never left alone and Denver was able to direct him into situations where his best option was to pass. In game one the Nuggets played off of him a little bit more and he was able to get off 19 shots. I think Denver decided that they would rather have Paul rack up the assists with a few points than a bunch of points with his typical amount of assists.
If that was indeed their thinking it could not have worked better. Ina game where I expected to see a hyper competitive CP3 look to dominate the game from start to finish, Paul only managed 11 shots. Not nearly enough to impact the game with his scoring.
Also from Wagner over at ESPN's Daily Dime (#7):
Much of the talk between Games 1 and 2 focused on how the Hornets needed to have someone other than Chris Paul and David West produce on offense. Wednesday night Peja Stojakovic and Rasual Butler were both hitting shots from behind the arc, combining to make 8-of-10 threes, but the Hornets never seemed to recognize that fact by feeding them the ball.
New Orleans kept forcing the ball to West who, despite finishing the game having shot 9-for-20, suffered through a 1-for-12 shooting stretch during which the Nuggets took control of the contest...
The story for Denver, even with another ridiculous performance by Chauncey Billups, has to be the all-around play of Carmelo Anthony. Melo has struggled in postseasons past due to his desire to force his offense against double teams. After five years of slamming his head against the wall he finally decided to look for a doorway. Wednesday he punished the Hornets for doubling him by finding open teammates to the tune of a career playoff-high nine assists.
Jimmy Smith has player and coach quotes from the Hornets after Game 2:
DAVID WEST
"I've just been missing some shots. Our entire offense is out of sync. We're just having to work a little too hard to score. That's the biggest thing. Working too hard. We can't get easy baskets. We've got to rely on some movement and not be so predictable."BYRON SCOTT
On his team's 17 turnovers that resulted in 23 Denver points.
"There were some careless turnovers and I think it's the first time all season when we had just one steal. So we're not being aggressive enough on the defensive end. But 23 points off 17 turnovers compared to their one, that's the difference in the game right there. And in the third quarter, they started off with two offensive rebounds and got a '3' out of that. There are a lot of little things we need to do a better job of."On whether team played more aggressively tonight
"I thought so. I really did. I thought we stood there, fought, played hard. We had some lapses on the defensive end in both halves. And the turnovers were a killer. When you turn the ball over on this team, they get out on the break, they're getting layups, getting dunks, so we've got to do a better job of making sure we take care of the ball."On whether he likes physical nature of series now
"Me personally? From the sideline? I wish I was out there, because I do like the physical part. Me, I don't mind it whatsoever. It's like I said: it had nothing to do with the physical part tonight. We turned the ball over too many times and had defensive lapses."Is there concern about Chandler's physical condition?
"Toward the end of the game he was limping a little bit, that's why I tried to get him out. We've got a couple of days for him to heal and rest and get some treatment. I think he'll be fine for Saturday."On what Hornets need to do differently on Saturday
"All they did was take care of home. That's the bottom line. Our objective was to come here and win a game and we didn't get it done. They took care of home so we've got to go back home and do the same thing. We play better in New Orleans, there's no doubt about that. Our fans have been fantastic all season long. Again, it's a challenge and we're looking forward to it."CHRIS PAUL
On what Nuggets are doing to disrupt his offense
"They're trying to get the ball out of my hands. They trap and corral and do all those different type things and tonight Peja got a lot of good looks. Him annd 'Sual were both 4 of 5 from the 3-point line. There were a few times you get in the lane and guys get a hand on it, but like Coach said, we turned the ball over too much. I think I turned it over five times. I threw two lobs to Tyson too high, threw one behind him, and that stuff comes back to bite us especially when they score in transition."On Billups performace in first two games
"He's played really well. I started off on him tonight, but then with the substitutions and stuff I didn't get to guard him that much. But he's playing as well as you can play right now. He's got like 19 assists and no turnovers and he's something like 12 of 15 from the 3-point line. . . . not much you can do."On whether two double-digit losses concern him
"Not at all. You look at us last year against the Spurs, I think that's why we can hold our head up. We won two games at home and everyone said it was over, we had those guys down. And the games in that series weren't very close. So like Coach keeps saying, they held serve and won their games at home now we've got to do the same."
From the AP game recap over at ESPN.com:
Karl said the pair of blowouts mean nothing when the series shifts to the Hornets' home court.
"They're going to be very angry and very physical," Karl said. "The game got a little more chippy tonight. It seemed like they were trying to tease us into mistakes and I'm sure it's going to continue on the road. Coach [Byron] Scott is obviously upset with the physicality of the game and we'll see where it goes."Scott said it wasn't the rough play that bothered him as much as his team's 17 turnovers, which led to 23 points, compared to Denver's six turnovers, which led to a single point by the Hornets...
Last year, the Hornets and Spurs played six straight games with double-digit margins before San Antonio eliminated New Orleans in the second round, and that's why Paul said the lopsided losses in Denver won't demoralize the Hornets.
"Not at all. You look at last year against the Spurs, I think that's why we can hold our heads up," he said. "We won two games at home and everyone said it was over, we've got these guys down. And games in that series weren't very close."As Coach keeps saying, 'They held serve, they won two games at home. Now we've got to do the same.'"...
This is the first time Billups has had consecutive turnover-free playoff games in the same year in his career. ... Hornets C Tyson Chandler aggravated his tender left ankle but said he was fine. ... Billups' dozen 3s are a franchise best for any playoff series. ... Billups has made 57 straight free throws overall.
Benjamin Hochman, The Denver Post:
The Nuggets entered the fourth quarter up 10, with the Hornets simmering, but J.R. Smith scored 10 points in lightning-quick fashion, including two hair-raising, crowd-raising 3s in the first three minutes. As they might say in Cajun country, it became a "bleaux-out."...
After Game 1, some of the Hornets cried foul on the Nuggets' hard fouls, notably from Jones. An hour before tipoff on Wednesday, Hornets coach Byron Scott said: "The way they were hitting us the other game, you wouldn't let a guy hit you like that on the street without reaction. We've got to stand up. Be a man."
Sure enough, Game 2 was more like Round 2. And the Nuggets got in the best blows.
Tyson Chandler shoved Nene, and the two got face-to-face until an official slipped between them. Anthony became tangled up with West in a heated moment. And in the third, Andersen toppled Paul during a layup attempt, earning a technical foul for the Birdman.
"We knew they would come out and try to play physical," Anthony said. "We wanted to give the hits and take the hits — be aggressive from the tip."
Jimmy Smith, New Orleans Times-Picayune:
Each Hornets player had a white piece of paper in his locker upon arrival Wednesday night at the Pepsi Center. And Paul hung it from the top of his cubicle.
" 'The spirit, the will to win, and the will to excel, are the things that endure. These qualities are so much more important than the events that occur.' -- Vince Lombardi."
The words of wisdom were provided by assistant coach Paul Pressey.
"That's something I thought was pretty cool," Scott said. "I thought it was fitting. My old saying is, and even though this is not our house, but 'You don't let anybody come into your house and put their feet on your coffee table.' That's disrespectful."
Chris Dempsey, The Denver Post:
Getting on track was supposed to be just a David West problem.
Now, it qualifies as a Chris Paul problem as well.
The Hornets are reeling, and the pillars they lean on — Paul and West — crumbled in Denver. West wanted to be more aggressive Wednesday night after a dismal Game 1, and he was — but his efficiency didn't improve all that much. He followed a 12-point Game 1 performance with 21 points in Game 2, but many of those came in the second half with the game already decided...
Of equal importance was Paul's paltry night. The guard has been hounded and harassed for two games now, but Wednesday night took the greatest toll. Paul made just 1-of-5 shots in the first quarter and 5-of-11 for the game. He finished with 14 points and 13 assists.
Paul made it known before the game that his goal in the second game was to shoot the ball better than in the first game. But he ended up shooting worse.
John Reid, New Orleans Times-Picayune:
To get his players inspired to play aggressively from the opening tip, Hornets Coach Byron Scott replayed the tape of Sunday's 29-point loss about 45 minutes before the game.
"It was the last thing I wanted them to see before we went out," Scott said. "This is not one of those games where you can wait until the third quarter and say it's time to start being physical. If you don't come out with an aggressive mindset from the start and understand how they are going to play from a physical standpoint, you are defeated already."...
Initially, when the Nuggets pushed for positioning in the post, the Hornets pushed back. For the first quarter, the Hornets defended well and only trailed 27-25.
The Hornets kept it going for the opening three minutes of the second quarter when they forced the Nuggets to miss six of the first seven shots, which enabled New Orleans to take a 31-30 lead.
At that point, the Nuggets went back to what worked in Game 1. They attacked the basket, took advantage of their physical play and forced the Hornets to take difficult shots. Paul was hounded by Dahntay Jones.
West stopped attacking the basket and could not make shots. Center Tyson Chandler's frustration grew to the point where he and Nene had to be separated after the Nuggets' big man beat him on a drive for a layup.
Ultimately, New Orleans could not prevent the same problem in Game 1 from reoccurring in the third and fourth quarters of Game 2. The Hornets could not make shots or stop the Nuggets from the scoring...
"When you have a seven-game series, you are not going to win the same way, you're not going to lose the same way," Nuggets Coach George Karl said. " We got to be able to adapt to their adjustments. People always talk about adjustments, most of them are made during the game. They said they are going to move West around. We kind of know their playbook."
John Henderson, The Denver Post:
He'll be the villain in New Orleans, no doubt. You can already hear the mob in the French Quarter warming up their lungs. The New Orleans Hornets chirped about his chippy play in Game 1.
They can't like him any better after Game 2.
But instead of harping about Dahntay Jones' cheap shots, they'll be harping about his big shots and defense in the third quarter Wednesday night, a combination that helped turn a close game into a rout that mirrored Game 1...
In about a four-minute span, the 6-foot-6 Jones hit two jumpers and a dunk, took two charges and made all-star Chris Paul look positively ordinary.
The spurt jacked Denver from a 63-58 lead to 73-60. New Orleans never got within 10 again.
Even for new Nuggets fans, a 2-0 lead might feel a bit weird. But for an old school Nuggets fan, seeing your team up 2-0 in the playoffs is totally surreal and it just hasn't sunk in yet. Even the Nuggets "glory" teams of 1984-85, 1985-86 and 1987-88 split their first two home games at McNichols Arena in their opening playoff series. In fact, the last time a Nuggets team took care of business at home and found themselves up 2-0 in a playoff series were those 1984-85 Nuggets, but that was in the second round against the Utah Jazz. In other words, it has been 24 long years since the Nuggets were up 2-0 in a playoff series!...
I want to give Nuggets coach George Karl a well deserved shout out, too. It's not easy to replicate a blowout in the playoffs and that's exactly what Karl's Nuggets have done. Typically the losing team from Game 1 makes major adjustments and brings a completely different energy into Game 2 (as we saw with Miami at Atlanta earlier tonight). And yet Karl has been able to keep the Nuggets focused on one game at a time, rather than foolishly look beyond this series. Karl is also visibly working the refs and managing the game more closely than he did throughout the regular season.
Benjamin Hochman, The Denver Post:
Nuggets center Nene is playing this series with a sore left hand, and even though he's right-handed, Nuggets coach George Karl said, "I think it's a little bigger deal than people think because he uses it and he likes to finish with his left as much as with his right."...
Think this series is physical? "This is not physical like it was in the '80s and '90s," said Scott, who won three rings with the Lakers as a player in the '80s. "It's so much watered-down, it's unbelievable. Some of the stuff we used to do, they wouldn't allow you to do right now. From that standpoint, it's not a physical game. I wish they would go back to the rules in the '80s and the '90s; it would separate a lot of the men from the boys."...
Paul used to play in New Orleans with Denver's J.R. Smith while Smith still developed as a young player out of high school.
"It's funny to see J.R. now in ball screens and things like that, because that used to be sort of J.R.'s Achilles' heel in that he didn't really handle the ball well," Paul said. "But he's playing with such a high confidence right now. When he catches the ball, no matter where he catches it from or shoots it from, I'm going to cringe, because I always think he's going to make it."
David Ramsey, Colorado Springs Gazette:
Scott played in the days when entering the lane was as dangerous as running across a freeway. Big men had all kinds of fun beating up other big men.
So why is Scott whining so much?
The answer is simple. Paul stands 5-foot-11 and weighs 170, at best. Everything about the Hornets revolves around Paul, who is wise, quick, fearless ...
And tiny, by NBA standards.
Scott wants referees to protect Paul. He wants to hear so many whistles that the Nuggets will soften their approach. He wants the lane to become a friendlier destination for his Hornets.
It is contradictory for Scott to talk with nostalgia for those violent days when, to use his words, you could tell the "the mens from the boys."
The best word to describe the Hornets in this game: lethargic. They looked almost as if they didn't care at times and couldn't wait to get back to New Orleans. This is very suprising considering their team captain. Chris Paul always gives maximum effort and expects nothing less from his teammates. Something tells me the Hornets' locker room was not a very pleasant place to be after tonight's game.
Finally, the Nuggets know again what it's like to be in control of series. They walloped New Orleans 108-93 Wednesday night at the Pepsi Center to go up 2-0 in their West first-round series.
If you want to know who might be the most excited, find forward Carmelo Anthony. In his first five trips to the Playoffs, Anthony never had won even two games in any series.
The Nuggets had lost five straight times in the first round, with no series even going six games. Their postseason record in Anthony's career had been 4-20 entering this spring...
The Nuggets haven't won a playoff series since 1994, the NBA's longest ongoing drought. That also was the last time Denver won even two games in one series.
With a raucous crowd of 19,623 jamming the Pepsi Center, Nuggets fans are letting it be known their team is no longer fool's gold in the Playoffs.
"The crowds are phenomenal,'' Billups said. "The guys are understanding that this is what homecourt advantage is all about... You got 20,000 people out there, cheering and rooting and frustrating the other team. Our crowd has been awesome.''
Rob Mahoney of Hardwood Paroxysm, in a post titled "George Karl is a Miracle Worker":
I have never seen a team completely frustrate Chris Paul so consistently over the course of two games. I was willing to give CP a pass for Game 1; the playoffs are a completely different ball game, and it can take time to adjust. But in Game 2, I saw a virtual repeat of one of the most frustrating defenses in these playoffs.
But how are the Nuggs even able to pull this off?...
What I’ve been impressed with most is the discipline. This team, for two games against the Hornets, has played tremendous team defense. We knew that Carmelo was a much improved defender, and we’ve seen Chauncey’s body of work when it comes to locking down point guards. What we didn’t know was that this roster, from Melo to Anthony Carter, was ready to suckerpunch New Orleans with all the Popovichian fury that this roster could muster. It’s a well-oiled machine that was oiled an extra time just for good measure, but the results are as organically beautiful as I ever could have imagined. Each Nugget has done their homework and is executing to perfection.
Quick hitters:
- Lagniappe: Episode 10 of On Point with Chris Paul
- Hornets.com: 2009 Playoffs Player Profiles
- NOLA.com: Cancer-survivor Nene excelling
P.M. Updates:
Posted at 12:45 p.m. Central.
To start, more walls from Dariusz:
Player and coach quotes from the Nuggets over at the T-P:
DAHNTAY JONES
"My job is to go out there, play hard and be aggressive. It's a fine line between being dirty and playing hard. As long as my teammates see it as playing hard, I'm fine with it.''CARMELO ANTHONY
"Our expectations this season were set high, despite what everbody else was saying. We wanted to be in this situation. We envisioned to be up 2-0 on our home court... We knew they was going to come out trying to play physical. We wanted to give the hits from the opening tip."COACH GEORGE KARL
"I'm a believer that nothing really happens until you lose a home playoff game. It's nice to be 2-0. It's something that hasn't happened since I've been here. We have a lot of work to do. We need to continue to work on getting an edge."
John DeShazier, New Orleans Times-Picayune:
True, it's a little reminiscent of last season, when the Hornets steamrolled San Antonio in the first two games of that series. The Spurs looked old and spent in New Orleans, appeared ready to be swept. The Hornets have looked so worn down in Denver you practically could hear them creak.
But the similarity ends there.
The Spurs have a championship pedigree, had some adversity to draw from. San Antonio knew it didn't need to panic, knew that if it could get the Hornets in an elimination-game situation, it would have an edge regardless of where the game was played.
Until the Hornets wade through such a scenario, all they can cling to are cliches. All they have right now is the head game that Denver has done nothing more than what it was favored to do and supposed to do - hold serve on its home court.
It's the only game New Orleans has played well so far in the playoffs. And if that's as good as it gets then Hornets fans had better enjoy Saturday and Monday - because if that's the case, the team won't be returning to New Orleans for Game 6.
David Schexnaydre Jr., NOLA.com:
Part of me wants to keep it in perspective and note how the Hornets simply lost two playoff games on another team's floor, which is actually rather common. Teams opening the playoffs at home take 2-0 leads all the time. And while I wish I could chalk up the previous two games to home court advantage, I know it's more than that. Like I said, I'm trying to keep it in perspective, but that perspective isn't very good at this point.
I mean, honestly, at any point throughout this series, has it really looked like the Hornets were the better team? I would have to say abolutely not...
How many times is Byron Scott going to let Denver go on a huge momentum-changing run without calling a time out to stop it? Part of using time outs is being proactive. When another starts to hit shots and the crowd starts to really get into it, burn a time out and put an end to it. In the second quarter, there's about 6 minutes left, and all of a sudden Denver starts getting hot. The crowd is getting into the game, the Nuggets are flying all over the place, and Byron is sitting on the bench with facial expressions and body language similiar to that of Mr. Kruger of Kruger Industrial Smoothing.
Among lots of thoughts from ticktock6 at Hornets Hype:
New Orleans fans (and players) have clearly been relying on Tyson Chandler’s return to give hope to this team… and… well, he’s something of an emotional leader for them, but he couldn’t even run in the 4th quarter. He was limping up and down the floor. If it wasn’t the playoffs, he wouldn’t be out there. His big return is just not gonna happen. Dude is hurt.
If we don’t win Game 3 shut him down? Just throwing it out there. I know we relied on him to inject some hope in this team, but it’s probably starting to be time to face the facts.
Nick Sclafani, The Nugg Doctor:
And boy did I love the individual effort by Dahntay Jones. He was flat out in the jockstrap and the head of Chris Paul. For each and every one of his 20 minutes of burn he didn’t allow Paul to breathe. Paul, blatantly taken out of his game, couldn’t even muster some of his patented flops and flails in an attempt to draw the fouls he usually warrants. The double edged effect that this had on Paul was staggering. He only shot five free-throws (he did make all five) and attempted eleven field goals in 38 minutes of burn of which he finished with 14 points and 13 assists. Or in other words, not even close to enough of an impact to get his team competitive in game two.
Additionally, and with these kinds of defensive efforts, it deserves a special note that the Nuggets have not lost a single quarter to the Hornets through two games of this series...Does anyone believe me now that the advantage at the point belongs to Denver? It’s OK, you can admit it now. Doing so is the first step in recovery as I know you thought I was crazy to write that in my series preview.
If the Hornets had control of this series, a 90-second highlight package the next morning would probably catch you up to speed on Chris Paul's performance: a couple of alley-oops, a few sneaky steals and a slick bounce bass between defenders to set up an easy layup and you've got the gist of it. He's a joy to watch over the course of an entire game, but if all you have is a minute and a half, you can still get almost as much fun in the amount of time it takes your toaster to thaw your frozen waffle.
To truly appreciate Chauncey Billups, though, requires an evening-long commitment. Not that he's a stranger to the occasional jump-out-of-your-seat play, but the hallmark of his game is efficiency, and that doesn't always translate to the highlight reel.
It's easy to string together video of eight made three-pointers like he did on Sunday, but how do you convey with a few clips how he's yet to turn the ball over after two games? Or the fact that he hasn't missed a free throw in 19 attempts? Or that he's shooting an obscene 60% from the field and 80% from three-point land?
To be fair, Paul usually shows as much as flash as efficiency, but not so far in the playoffs. Through two games, he's shooting 40% with nine turnovers. Yes, he's tallied a double-double in both games, but that hasn't helped the Hornets stay competitive, let alone actually win a game. Instead, it's been all Billups, all the time; it's just too bad his brilliance is on display while most of the country is asleep.
Quick hitter:
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47 super-fantastic comments post your own
Mikey
04/23/09 10:33 AM
I found myself wondering last night on a few occasions, how would the Hornets have faired with Chris Wilcox and Joe Smith, had the Chandler trade actually gone through? Food for thought.
#1
bigindian15
04/23/09 10:43 AM
"At that point, the Nuggets went back to what worked in Game 1. They attacked the basket, took advantage of their physical play and forced the Hornets to take difficult shots. Paul was hounded by Dahntay Jones."
No, they went back to what worked, which was actually not getting called for obvious fouls, letting Andersen do whatever the hell he wanted and showboat and throw himself off the rim without getting called for anything, and letting Jones try to give Paul a handjo- er, foul him all the time!
"Scott played in the days when entering the lane was as dangerous as running across a freeway. Big men had all kinds of fun beating up other big men.
So why is Scott whining so much?
The answer is simple. Paul stands 5-foot-11 and weighs 170, at best. Everything about the Hornets revolves around Paul, who is wise, quick, fearless"
Did I miss something? One thing you can't really accuse Byron of ever is complaining to the refs. We all want him to do that more for Christmas sakes...
#2
sdr
04/23/09 10:46 AM
I predicted a 4-1 loss in the series, but now I think they're going to
sweep us. There are 2 teams (Houston and Denver) that have figured out that the Hornets are done against a tight defense. Hornets can't adjust to it; bad coaching, lack of energy (what else is new), and of course Paul is exhausted from carrying the team through the regular season. I hope Shin realizes it's time to clean house, I
would fire everyone starting with Jeff Bower and rebuild the team around
Paul, Butler, and West. It's supposed to be a "TEAM", 2 or 3 players can't do it alone.
So, Let's be realistic fans. We have been delusional this season; it was Pargo that made the difference last year --that goes towards Joe Block too who is also delusional. Bring Pargo back at any cost!
#3
MonstaBee
04/23/09 10:47 AM
I think we have covered most of my observations, except one. I have said all season that our bench comes in and has no chance of being successful. Lobbing the ball to one player, whether it be Posey, West, or whoever, is not an offense to be run by guys of our limited talent. I have proposed that they run hard picks to get open looks...and some have said that isnt the problem. Fine then. But I wont accept that it is good coaching to bring the bench in only to have first possession shot clock violation or thrown up prayers at the buzzer. Bad, no, terrible coaching!
Very grumpy today.
#4
bigindian15
04/23/09 10:57 AM
"So, Let's be realistic fans. We have been delusional this season; it was Pargo that made the difference last year --that goes towards Joe Block too who is also delusional. Bring Pargo back at any cost!"
Agreed: let's be realistic guys. Last year, after games 1 and 2 in New Orleans, all the "experts" said that the Spurs were too old to keep up with the physicality of the young CP and TC and could not make it back and predicted Hornets in 5 or 6. Well, that didn't happen.
Everything changes when we go to New Orleans and Denver is not getting every single call. If Denver doesn't get every call, New Orleans can defend properly without risking fouls or techs, and the end of every third and the beginning of every fourth quarter changes.
Oh, and Chris Andersen is neutralized. I promise he gets at least 3 techs in last night's game for his...shenanigans for lack of a better word
#5
BeesGivingEffort
04/23/09 11:02 AM
Officiating was terrible. Awful. Atrocious. Etc. Like a guy at the bar I was watching the game said, it's hard to play this team, much less the officials at the same time. The officiating in the last two games has been a horrible tone setter for the Hornets and a great one for the Nuggets. The Hornets are playing like they don't know what to do anymore on D, and the Nuggets are having fun and bombing away from wherever because they're up 12 in what should be a close, tight game. And typically, the officials made up for it once the game was out of hand to save their *****.
SHOOT THE BALL HORNETS! So many wide open looks that have been getting passed up. You're open. You're on the floor. Shoot...The...Ball...
David West is not an all-star. Sorry he isn't. He does this frequently in the face of other bigname, phyiscal Power Forwards (if you can even consider K-Mart a bigname PF).
Chris Paul left his jumper in New Orleans. So tired of hearing Denver people brag about Dirty Jones and George Karl. It's plain and simple, Chris Paul was not Chris Paul in Denver and should he ever be Chris Paul again in this series, there will be nothing that piece of trash Jones can do about it.
I hate watching Denver play. After one series they have completely jumped to the front of my West hate list by the attitudes they display on the court. There is no respect given towards the Hornets. They gloat and smile and act like thugs all game long. They whine to the officials about EVERY call that goes against them.
I am really frustrated after last night. When TNT flipped to their "look at Chauncey drawing fouls" highlight reel, I just wanted to flip out.
@Mikey: Alot better.
#6
ticktock6
04/23/09 11:26 AM
Thinking the calls are going to drastically change when the series gets to New Orleans is pretty much an illustration, for me, of what's wrong with officiating in the league in general.
hornetshype.com #7
snafu
04/23/09 12:10 PM
Just a quick tidbit that people often don't understand...defensive players can draw charges with their feet moving and/or in the restricted circle IF they are the primary ball defender and maintain good defensive position.. The stuff about stationary feet and staying out of the restricted circle ONLY applies to help defense from somebody who is rotating to protect the rim. However, since most charges are taken by a rotating help defender, almost all fans think that charges can only be taken if the defender has his feet set and is outside the circle.
In the context of this game, a couple of the offensive foul calls that may have looked terrible (D West driving on JR, Chris Paul driving on Dahntay Jones) were actually not that bad because in both scenarios the defender who drew the foul was the primary ball defender and they maintained their defensive position throughout the drive. In both cases and it was the offensive player who initiated contact on a retreating defender.
I'm not saying the officiating was good all night, as some of those fouls on Billups were really ticky tack, I just don't think a few of those charging calls should be thrown onto the list of mistakes.
#8
QueenBee
04/23/09 12:11 PM
CP's brother in a recent article said CP weighs 190 now. Haha. And coaches always talk about how strong he is. It's not about how big you are but how strong you are. Also, my new motto is "The NBA.... Where Cheating Happens" and Stern won't be satisfied until people aren't watching his product anymore. I wonder, is Tim Donaghy allowed to make phone calls from prison to his good long-time friend Scott Foster? A fan of another team told me he thinks the Hornets will win games 3 & 4. I told him I'm so happy he thinks so. Our team will definitely need the support on Saturday and Monday. FAN UP NEW ORLEANS!
#9
YoungFella
04/23/09 12:19 PM
@ Mikey: I would respond to your question with "How would the Hornets fare with a healthy Tyson Chandler who didn't feel the need to defend his playing ability by forcing himself to rush back prematurely from a bum ankle to prove Bower was a moron for trading him for two stiffs".
#10
YoungFella
04/23/09 12:27 PM
Nothing has changed in the Chandler trade argument.
You either support dumping a fairly compensated starting center who fits this team perfectly and, when healthy, can man up on Duncan, Yao, and Howard.
Or you support blowing up one of the 3 key pieces of a team that was running 2nd or 3rd in the West despite horrible drafting, free agency, and coaching decisions.
Chandler rushing back from his initial ankle doesn't change the question. You were either for blowing up the team as a result of the horrible Posey signing or you weren't.
#11
Mark
04/23/09 01:46 PM
Wasn't TyTy relatively active during his short spurt the games following his rescinded trade?
www.dogpile.com/ #12
benreed1088
04/23/09 01:53 PM
The biggest problem i think we have is not the rescninded chandler trade but the fact that we dont have a slashing 2 or 3, that not only can create their own shot but someone that draws fouls. We dont have a single person who consistently drives to the basket and draws fouls except chris paul.
#13
QueenBee
04/23/09 01:53 PM
Tyson is probably going to need surgery on that ankle. If he does exactly how long will that take to figure out? This is what Tyson wrote in one of his latest blogs...
"After I went back out, I obviously wanted to come back as soon as I could. It has just been a really tough injury. Normally when you sprain your ankle, you just damage the ligaments or stretch the ligaments. When I sprained mine, I damaged the tendon, so I had fluid in my tendon. When you damage your tendon it takes a long time to heal. It's a longer process."
That's a serious ankle injury. It probably won't heal while being on it or without surgery. What kind of ankle injury did Ginobili have? He had to have surgery for whatever it was. What if Tyson has a serious problem that won't get better. How exactly will that help the team? I hope the guy gets better and we somehow manage to keep him because I love what a healthy Tyson brings to our team.
#14
benreed1088
04/23/09 01:58 PM
a healthy tyson is very important to our team..however the tyson that we have presently who isn't getting off of his feet for rebounds is not helping this team.
#15
bigindian15
04/23/09 02:10 PM
Tyson is more important to us than West. Trade West and hopefully get back an adequate PF and a good 2 guard, then have Butler off the bench. Butler and Posey off the bench is good enough against most teams.
I'm not sure the salary dump was only because of the Posey signing. The Hornets and Shinn would have been trying to dump salary if we had signed someone else instead of Posey using the same money.
Again, stop blaming Bower for the trade. The order came down to trade Chandler to clear cap space. So he did. He got the best offer he could find, and I still don't think it was the crappiest offer in the world like everyone else seems to
#16
YoungFella
04/23/09 02:39 PM
How is Bower not to be blamed for the trade? He's consistently failed to manage/cultivate the roster and bring in an effective slasher. Every move he's made has failed. Worse, every move he's made has deepened the hole.
Trade for Bonzi/James - hole gets deeper
Sell draft pick and forego cheap young energy - hole gets deeper
Don't resign Pargo - hole gets deeper
Don't resign Birdman - hole gets deeper
Sign Posey - hole gets deeper
Trade for Daniels - hole gets deeper
Bower has not made a single good personnel decision in the last 14 months.
Bristow made good move after good move after good move. West, JR, Bass, Birdman, Nachbar. Bam, bam bam bam bam. Diamonds in the rough all of them. We haven't had a find like that since Bristow departed. And let's not forget him drafting CP3 although I doubt Bower would have blown THAT one.
#17
benreed1088
04/23/09 02:52 PM
I agree i think bower has been with this organization way too long. I dont know how much byron scott is involved in the trade process and selection process. I dont know if byron scott not liking jr smith or brandon bass is the reason why they were traded or if bower said we acn get this awesome deal that will make us a better team. But it seems like shinn really likes bower. He has been with the organization for 14 years so maybe bower tells shinn this is a good move and we need to make it. I dont know, but this team was completely different before bower started acting as gm.
#18
ticktock6
04/23/09 02:55 PM
Birdman was not a mistake. I am pretty tired of hearing about Birdman with 20/20 hindsight. He gave no indication he was better than any of our other scrubby backup bigs in his time last spring. And you don't have any knowledge of how it was behind the scenes. Maybe West and CP were like, uh-uh, we're still annoyed at him for betraying the team by being dumb and doing drugs.
You can say it was a mistake, but it's certainly not something the team can be blamed for.
hornetshype.com #19
bigindian15
04/23/09 03:09 PM
I agree with ticktock6. Birdman isn't exactly a saint or anything, the dude was out for a DRUG SUSPENSION. In addition to his garbage play last season, I would fully defend the organization not wanting him on the team because, in New Orleans of all places, they were worried about him slipping back into old habits.
So Hollinger (whom I hate) is having a chat on ESPN right now and he is talking about how Melo scorched Peja last night and Peja was horrible and Melo was great and shot lights out and everything. Ummm, last I checked, 22 points on 20 shots is not lights out. Melo didn't exactly do a great job on Peja either
@Youngfella:
Trade for Bonzi/James: we liked the Bonzi trade at the time, and Bobby Jackson was rotting on the bench anyway
Sell draft pick: we also liked the Posey signing at the time
Don't resign Pargo: he wasn't worth the contract he wanted
Don't resign Birdman: see above
Trade for Daniels: how the hell did the hole get deeper?? Would you rather have Mike James backing up now?
I'm not sure if West was a diamond in the rough, he was just in the deepest draft in 20 years. Look at his college stats and awards. Dude was a beast. Bass didn't do jack in two years here (blame Byron or whoever you want, but not Bower). Birdman got SUSPENDED FOR DRUGS, which I'm pretty sure Bower didn't sell him so it's not his fault. Nachbar...not exactly a great move, seeing as how the team sucked back then so he didn't really contribute anything
#20
Juncti
04/23/09 03:24 PM
ticktock, I get what you're saying about Birdman, but 1 time is a mistake, over and over and over again is a trend.
The only consistency with the Hornets of late has been misusing and developing talent and then trading them away only to have them develop elsewhere.
What are other teams doing with these players that we aren't?
#21
ticktock6
04/23/09 03:30 PM
I don't understand what's wrong with the Daniels move either. He's better than James, James had a bad attitude, and their contracts are identical. ??
hornetshype.com #22
Mark
04/23/09 04:08 PM
I thought the Bonz was a good trade. He didn't play too well, but we had Pargo at the time, who was essentially a cheaper version. Birdman was an afterthought last year, and nobody at the time appealed his signing with the Nugs. Antonio Daniels trade was great. I don't care what people say. He's not doing well on our squad, but he's not Mike James. You guys forget who our scapegoat was early this season?
People always say Devin Harris-Jason Kidd trade was a mistake. IT WASN'T. Which one of you guys saw through Devin Harris' 3 1/2 years in Dallas? Which one of you guys watched the Mavs during his 3 1/2 years in Dallas? Which one of you guys know the gameplan for Jersey right now? Everybody sees statistics up for players, but don't remember the lack of progression players had during their old respective teams, much less the new conditions players are exposed to right now.
www.dogpile.com/ #23
YoungFella
04/23/09 05:01 PM
@ Ticktock: If you didn't want Birdman back for under $800,000 than you're crazy. End of story. Even what he gave us last year (after he had been out of the league for 2 seasons) was superior to anything a big has given us since Tyson was healthy.
@ Bigindian: Drading for Daniels made the hole $400,000 deeper. Simple math.
@ Mark: The Bonzi trade wasn't a good trade. We traded a valuable expiring and became saddled with another bad contract (James) that we parlayed into an even worse contract (Daniels).
@ Bigindian: If you think Pargo isn't worth $4.5 million and Posey is worth $6.5 million over 5 years than I can't help you brother. Maybe we can just follow your idea though from a previous post and trade Peja for a 2nd rounder (LOL!).
I'm glad that you all think everything is so rosy with the Hornets organization. I wish I had that kind of optimism. In my opinion (and I've been saying it since the Tyson trade) the writing is on the wall. We'll be dumping West and/or Tyson this offseason, we'll be a lottery team next season, and CP3 will be very unhappy.
#24
YoungFella
04/23/09 05:06 PM
Daniels and James' contracts are close, but not identical.
Daniels makes over $400,000 more this year and next than James. That might not sound like a lot, but it would have paid for over half of Chris Andersen's salary, or it could quadruple the Hornets' scouting department, or it could go towards 20,000,000 New Testaments for Shinn to give out to every paying fan at home games for the next 20 seasons.
It's the smallest of the reasons that I mentioned above (and it's dwarfed by the sheer idiocy of signing 32 year old James Posey to a 5 year contract when we know that we'll be over the luxury tax), but it is still a fact that trading James for Daniels made the Hornets' financial hole deeper.
#25
ticktock6
04/23/09 05:13 PM
No one's saying everything's rosy, just that some of those statements don't really make that much sense given the information people had to work with at the time the decisions were made. And no, I don't think I'm crazy to not care about a guy who played 6 minutes in 5 games last year and averaged 1 point and 1.8 rebounds.
If the franchise is going to be made/broken over $400K, they probably shouldn't be operating in a professional league. It's negligible considering the roughly $70mil they're throwing around in salary.
hornetshype.com #26
bigindian15
04/23/09 05:57 PM
Seriously. I think you're making a ridiculous assertion about Andersen. He was giving us nothing, and we already had 2 guys in Ely and Armstrong under contract. Why would we sign another backup big who we thought would give us nothing? I don't mean to make personal attacks, but you're not making any sense trying to argue this one.
#27
bigindian15
04/23/09 06:08 PM
Now, about Posey: first of all, he signed a 4 year contract, not 5. Second of all, let's compare his and Pargo's numbers, shall we?
Pargo 2007-2008: 8.1 ppg, 2.4 ast, 1.6 rpg. 39.0% fg, 34.9% threes, 87.7% ft, 0.6 stl, 1.2 turnovers
Posey 2008-2009: 8.9 ppg, 1.1 ast, 4.8 rpg. 41.2% fg, 36.9% threes, 82.2% ft, 0.8 stl, 1.1 turnovers
Keep in mind that Posey played absolute garbage the last 2 months and had a lil injury at the end. Other than that, the numbers slightly favor Posey. Not to mention that as much as we bitch about him, he's been a lot more consistent than Pargo was last year.
Also keep in mind our wings after last season: Mo Pete (didn't give us much), Peja, and Wright (horribly inconsistent). That's abouuuuuuut it. We also already had Mike James on contract, who was supposed to be a spark plug off the bench to provide instant offense. Sound familiar? So we already had a guy who we thought could replace Pargo. Turns out, he couldn't.
Ok, about the Hornets always misjudging talent:
They messed up with Bass. I give them a mulligan. Everyone messes up occasionally.
They didn't mess up with JR. They judged his talent correctly. They traded him because he is a nutcase. George Karl can apparently handle his insanity a little better than Byron, maybe because Karl doesn't require the same hard-nosed defense and discipline that Byron does from his guys.
They didn't mess up with Andersen. He didn't play well when he got back last year, he had a history of drug problems, and we already had guys on the payroll to give us the same thing.
If you want to make a level headed, rational argument, then please feel free to respond :D
#28
Niall Doherty
04/23/09 06:53 PM
@ YoungFella: I think you get people's backs up here because you relentlessly harp on about the bad/controversial things Bower and the Hornets have done while giving them very little (if any) credit for the good moves they made. Maybe you don't realize you do it, or maybe you just like getting a reaction. Either way, it's getting old. We get that you don't like Posey, we get that you would have kept Pargo and Birdman if you were GM, and that you'd never have made the Bonzi trade. We've heard all of that several times now. Let's skip over the same old arguments and discuss something else, like what moves the Hornets can make this summer to right the ship.
www.ndoherty.com #29
Andrea
04/23/09 07:10 PM
I disagree with anyone who says that the Hornets have misjudged talent.
-Not holding on to JR Smith was a great move. Kid's got all the potential in the world, but he's extremely full of himself and not worth the hassle because he still hasn't given much indication that he can be consistent.
-Not holding on to Bird was a so/so move. I thought we should've kept him because we needed another big man but he didn't give us any indication that he would do much for us if we kept him.
-Not holding on to Brandon Bass wasn't a bad move. Of the three, he's the only one who I would love to have right now. Bass wasn't really given much opportunity to show out so maybe it was best for us to let him move on and get an opportunity somewhere else.
Something else to keep in mind is the work that various coaching staffs, trainers, etc. from different organizations do with their players. For example, Dallas staff has helped Bass become the player that I doubt he would've been had he stayed in N.O.
#30
Dmon3k
04/23/09 09:07 PM
Andrea your comment about Bass is what strikes me though about this team. I'm not sure if it is Byron Scott or someone above him, but he really doesn't give his young guys a chance to shine. I was looking back at some stats and Brandon Bass averaged 9 minutes a game his first season and 7.7 his second and played a combined 50 games. I mean how much can you really show in that short of time, suddenly he goes to the Mavs and is given 20 minutes a game and sees a lot of action and magically his numbers go up. Byron has to give some of these younger guys a real chance in games or the bench is never gonna develop and then CP3 will get frustrated due to lack of talent around him, and want out of NO, and then we'll be stuck in the basement again.
#31
benreed1088
04/23/09 09:47 PM
I really think that in the offseason if we can pick up a slashing 2 and a shot blocking/rebounding center we will be in good shape next season...was looking for a list of free agents next year, anyone have one?
#32
Dmon3k
04/23/09 10:09 PM
With what money are we supposed to get a quality free agent?
#33
Andrea
04/23/09 11:04 PM
@Dmon3k: I know we have a luxury tax issue, but I don't think we have salary cap issues
#34
bigindian15
04/23/09 11:12 PM
We still have the mid level exception, don't we? And if we trade someone...
I dunno how many of these guys we can afford, but just scanning the list:
Brandon Bass
Gerald Green (maybe worth a shot)
Birdman himself
Von Wafer (hellz yeah)
Marquis Daniels (hellz yeah)
Rasho Nesterovic (champ experience too)
Trevor Ariza
Chris Wilcox (ironic yes, but I think he'd be good off our bench)
Matt Barnes
Drew Gooden
Anthony Parker (dunno if he's a slasher though)
Juan Dixon
Realistically, the only guys there we can afford are probably Bass, Green, Rasho, Wilcox, Barnes, Gooden, Parker, and maybe Dixon. The problem is, I'm 90% sure Bass, Birdman, Von Wafer, Daniels, Ariza, Barnes, and Gooden will be overpaid by some stupid ass club (hello Clippers!) so we really don't know yet
Buuuuuuuuuut I think the best way to get it done is trade. I think the best way to shed salary and get something good back would have to be to trade West, unfortunately, but I think we could probably package a bad contract with him. Probably not Peja, but probably Mo Pete or Posey, or probably Daniels easily because he's expiring
#35
YoungFella
04/23/09 11:22 PM
@ Niall:
I'm really sorry you feel that way, bro. I think you're wrong in that I have always defended Chandler passionately and intelligently, backing up my arguments with stats, game situations, and hard records. I defended West passionately and intelligently back when he was struggling and before he went on his All-Star clinching tear in early January. I am optimistic and positive on things that are worthy of being upbeat about. I don't go around looking to be morose and pessimistic.
You and others don't like me being negative about the Hornets front office? Guess what - neither do I. I hate that our GM is horrible. I hate that he guaranteed $28 million to a 32 year old role player who was overrated to begin with while letting young cheap talent walk for no compensation. I hate that Posey is horrible, but I don't sit here and root for it. I prefaced virtually every anti-Posey statement I've made by saying that he probably WILL step his game up in the playoffs.
The fact remains though: this franchise is in some DEEP trouble. I've been saying it since February and I'm sorry that I'm looking more and more right as time goes by. If you want to squash the messenger it's your site. But I think that intelligent discourse should always be welcomed. You will always have your "let's just cut Peja or trade him for a pick!" homers but good knowledgeable posters aren't too easy to come by. I said as far back as February that there are realistic scenarios where David West will be traded this offseason. That's looking like a 50/50 proposition at this point.
If my point of view isn't welcomed or appreciated that's fine. I really didn't expect this from your site though. I thought this was a cut above "positive only" sites like HornetsReport.com where you are censored and/or banned if you don't toe the line.
#36
NIH87
04/23/09 11:46 PM
Why is youngfella catching so much crap here? Is reality hard to deal with? The Hornets are in this salary cap hell because of the incompetence of both the FO and coaching. If Scott develops young talent well the Hornets don't have to sign some over the hill SF or 2 to ridiculous contracts to upgrade the bench. Teams like San Antonio, Utah, Orlando, etc. have all been very good at finding cheap FAs or steals in the draft to upgrade the bench where as we sign over the hill players like Posey, Mo, etc. The Hornets aren't following the sucessful blueprint that these small market teams have laid out, instead they've opted to be ''big time FA players'' and that's how we end up in the luxury tax. Because of the horrible contracts that Bowrus handed out, we're pretty much stuck with this roster for at least 1-3 years. No one will want Peja, Mo, Posey, etc. So what we have seen this year is pretty much what we will see next year and maybe the year after, give or take a few wins.
I'd say this playoff run is opening CP3 and DX's eyes to how screwed they are, for this team to even have a chance to win they have to play 40mins a night at 100%. Just for a chance to win! It is up to Bowrus/Scott to re-tool this roster, and I have no faith that they will do so sucessfully. CP3 and DX probably have their doubts as well, and that is very concerning.
#37
sdr
04/23/09 11:57 PM
If you're going to compare Posey and Pargo, then you forgot a very vital statistic:
ENERGY LEVEL:
Pargo 154%, Posey 3.2%
#38
sdr
04/23/09 11:59 PM
Peja, Posey, Daniels are playing like senior citizens. Not their fault, they're just old, but they don't deserve the money they make. Get rid of Bower, He's the incompetent one.
#39
YoungFella
04/24/09 12:03 AM
@ NIH:
Great points - you should post here more often dude. To piggyback on what you said, another way in which the Hornets don't follow the Blazers/Thunder/Spurs/Jazz model is in their scouting of foreign players. Talk about a cheap way to mine and exploit great talent - overseas scouts are like a free supplemental draft each year. But guess what? The Hornets have the skimpiest scouting department in American major league sports. NOH has exactly zero overseas scouts. Are you kidding me? This just makes my blood boil when I think about it.
People get mad at me for saying that the $400,000 "upgrade" for Antonio Daniels is not a big deal. When you're working on the meager budget that the Hornets are it's a huge deal. That could pay for 4 overseas scouts. That could pay for 6 domestic scouts. We're talking about increasing our scouting department by 250% to 300% with that kind of money.
Finally, I don't think anybody has dropped this pearl yet: The Hornets turned Bobby Jackson into two scrubs (one of whom saddled us with yet another horrible contract). By comparison, a competent organization like the Rockets turned Bobby Jackson into Ron Artest.
It's awful hard to be optimistic when you stop and look at the big picture.
#40
Apple
04/24/09 02:23 AM
One question...."Where's the fire?"
I haven't seen fire in the Hornets eyes in a very long time. Too long! Look at the other playoff games and the players are filled with it!
If we don't see any fire Saturday I don't expect to see it until next year.
appleita.blogspot.com/ #41
Niall Doherty
04/24/09 06:36 AM
@ YoungFella: I'm not saying you're wrong on the points you make. I happen to agree with a lot of them. But you've made these same points several times now and it seems like you only bring them up again to get a reaction or to say "I told you so." (Maybe I'm wrong about that but it's certainly the impression I get.) I value the discussion you bring to this site, even if it's heated every now and then, but I feel like I'm reading the same arguments every few weeks.
Your point about scouting is fresh and interesting. Regarding Posey, it's now the playoffs and he's done absolutely nothing so far to redeem himself from a disappointing regular season - it's hard for me to call him anything but a waste of money at this point. I believe people give Pargo too much credit. He might have given us an All-Star performance every now and then, but for each of those nights he'd also deliver four D-League-worthy performances. And if he was such a great player and difference-maker, he should have been able to sign with another NBA team for good money rather than having to go play ball in Europe.
Lastly, the Rockets didn't turn Bobby Jackson into Ron Artest. They turned Jackson, Donte Green and a first round pick into Ron Artest. And let's not forget that Artest was a major wild card and Houston were risking a lot by picking him up. Lucky for them it turned out well, but that's what the NBA is all about: there are no guarantees, so you calculate the risks as best you can and take the ones that feel right. Sometimes they work out, lots of times they don't. Only one team out of thirty can win it all, so we'll be among 28 other losers if we fail this season.
www.ndoherty.com #42
benreed1088
04/24/09 08:40 AM
@apple
I agree i also dont see the fire or hussle needed to make it through in the playoffs.
#43
YoungFella
04/24/09 01:32 PM
@ Niall: Fair points regarding Artest's "risk factor" but we had the ammo to get him for sure if we'd had a little more creative GM. Jackson, our wasted 1st from last year, and JuJu would have been an equal package to what Houston offered.
I haven't seen anything creative or foresightful from Bower during his tenure. We'll need to see 2 or 3 examples of that this offseason from him for next year to be anything better than a fight for the 8th seed in the West.
#44
YoungFella
04/24/09 01:37 PM
I don't know if theres another team in NBA history that has two All-Starts in their starting lineup who combined make less than 1/6th of the luxury threshhold (only $13MM between CP3 and DX) who each start over 90% of the regular season games, that DOESN'T finish higher than - say - a 4th seed.
The deck is really stacked in your favor if you have a top 5 PG in NBA history making a pittance, and a 2 time all star playing the 4 spot who is also making below market value. You have to be a pretty huge disaster in every other aspect of your roster (salary, talent, wasting draft picks) to not be a great team.
What is happening with the Hornets this season and in the next 2 seasons will be painfully reminiscent of what happened with Pete Maravich and Archie Manning in decades past. And that kills me. It's so rotten. We should trade CP3 for the good of the league if we can't do a better job of giving him a chance to win. He's one of the best human beings in the NBA and the Hornets should be ashamed.
#45
ticktock6
04/24/09 02:12 PM
@Youngfella Oh come on. I thought parlaying Mike James into anything-not-Mike-James was pretty creative. :-D
hornetshype.com #46
NIH87
04/24/09 05:50 PM
Yeah, we went from a crappy backup PG to another crappy backup PG. yay, go bower!
#47