Since the end of the season and the Game That Will Not Be Named, the knee-jerk reaction of a lot of fans to the question "What do the Hornets need" has been "everything". I'd prefer to go with a much more quantifiable list, so I've put together what I think is a pretty solid set. In this post I'm not going to hit actual players the Hornet's should target, but rather set down three weaknesses that if the Hornets shore up, I feel they can get back to elite status. In order of importance:
1. A Rebounding Back-up Big - If they have to rely on Armstrong as more than a 4th big man, The Hornets aren't going very far. The backup doesn't even need to be a big scorer, they just need to be able to post at least an average rebound rate, not turn the ball over every time they breath on it, and be trusted to play 20 minutes a game.
2. A True Shooting Guard - The Hornets don't have a shooting guard on the team, unless you want to count Devin Brown. I don't. The primary wing players; Posey, Wright, Butler, Peterson and Stojakovic, don't have the ball-handling to be a shooting guard. This puts tremendous pressure on Paul, as he must always bring the ball up the court and he must always be the one to initiate penetration. That second part is key - the player can't just be an Antonio Daniels style point guard reserve - they must be able to create some sort of shot on their own. Jannero Pargo, Speedy Claxton, and the 28-year old version of Devin Brown served that role for Byron Scott in past years, allowing Paul a little rest during the game. It's still clearly something the team needs. The player doesn't have to be a starter - they just need to provide around 18-24 minutes of penetration, ball-handling and/or scoring, giving Paul 12 minutes of rest on the bench, and 6-12 minutes with Paul where the opposing team have to worry about perimeter penetration from two players at the same time.
3. Scoring Support - It's a little simplistic, but it seems to me that there are two ways to contend for a title in the NBA: Field a team with two Class A scorers, and surround them with specialists(see Shaq-Kobe or Shaq-Wade, 2nd Three-Peat Bulls) or field a team with one Class A scorer, and two Class B scorers, then fill in around the edges.(Ginobili-Duncan-Parker, Jordan-Pippen-Grant, Dantley-Thomas-Dumars, Hamilton-Billups-Sheed) The Hornets are currently built around a Class A scorer(Paul) and one Class B scorer(West), and one scorer(Peja) who they hoped would be Class B, but has fallen to Class C. To me, they either need to find another class B scorer on the cheap or try and upgrade their Class B scorer to a Class A one. The question is, however, who do I classify as a Class A or Class B Scorer? Class A are those players who are not only efficient scorers(points per shot of 1.3 or better) but whom retain that efficiency while taking around a dozen shots or more. Class B are those scorers who average between 1.2 and 1.3 points per shot, while taking the same number of shots per game. Just because it's interesting, I'll list the Class A scorers here for your perusal.
| Player Name | Points Per Shot | Shots Per Game |
|---|---|---|
| Dwight Howard | 1.66 | 12.4 |
| Shaquille O'Neal | 1.59 | 11.2 |
| Kevin Martin | 1.55 | 15.9 |
| Amare Stoudemire | 1.51 | 14.1 |
| Corey Maggette | 1.5 | 12.4 |
| Yao Ming | 1.47 | 13.4 |
| Gerald Wallace | 1.46 | 11.5 |
| LeBron James | 1.43 | 19.9 |
| Chauncey Billups | 1.43 | 12.5 |
| Chris Paul | 1.42 | 16.1 |
| Devin Harris | 1.41 | 15.1 |
| Paul Pierce | 1.4 | 14.6 |
| Eric Gordon | 1.39 | 11.6 |
| Manu Ginobili | 1.39 | 11.2 |
| Ray Allen | 1.38 | 13.2 |
| Chris Bosh | 1.38 | 16.4 |
| Mehmet Okur | 1.38 | 12.3 |
| Dwayne Wade | 1.37 | 22 |
| John Salmons | 1.36 | 13.4 |
| Steve Nash | 1.36 | 11.5 |
| Danny Granger | 1.35 | 19.1 |
| Kevin Durant | 1.35 | 18.8 |
| Andre Igoudala | 1.34 | 14 |
| Brandon Roy | 1.34 | 16.9 |
| Deron Williams | 1.34 | 14.5 |
| Richard Jefferson | 1.32 | 14.9 |
| Jameer Nelson | 1.32 | 12.6 |
| Tim Duncan | 1.31 | 14.8 |
| Dirk Nowitzki | 1.3 | 20 |
| Kobe Bryant | 1.29 | 20.9 |
Some items of interest from the list - Kobe isn't that efficient of a scorer and if I stuck to my 1.3 points per shot cut off, he would have just missed this list, Shaq and Manu were both fairly low on taking shots this year(11.2), though they retained their efficiency, and Dwight Howard and Kevin Martin's efficiency levels are crazy. For a perimeter player, Martin is flat out insane.
Anything else you think the Hornets need desperately? Comment away.


40 life-affirming comments post your own
michael
05/29/09 12:07 PM
Good read, although Points per shot can be misleading at times. In reality, the Hornets have to build toward 2 or 3 years down the line. We cant just fill gaps and be happy winning 55 games. We have to slash payroll and get value for West, either by moving him with a horrible contract like Peja or Mo, or by getting some more active bigs and a true number 2. My plan:
West, Mo, and Hilton for Rip and Amir Johnson
Chandler and Daniels for Shaq
Posey for T. Allen, Giddens and Mikki Moore in a sign and trade (2 years 3 mil)
Draft Teague or Thornton to be Pargo 2.0
Make the playoffs and a bunch of money this year. Lose in the 1st or second round. Then you have over $35 million come off the books, you still have paul, Rip, the draft pick, Giddens on a rookie contract, the option to sign Amir as a hustle guy, JuJu, and best of all- Peja's expiring deal to bring back a big man or let it expire and have $30 million in cap room in 2010/2011. Use that to bring in 2 "type B" or 1 type A, 1 type B scorers to go with Paul, Rip, Wright, and some solid guys off the bench (Teague, Giddens, Amir and the 2010 draft pick) and you have a championship contender that will make CP3 want to re sign.
#1
Ryan Schwan
05/29/09 12:18 PM
I also forgot to mention this, Eric Gordon was the only rookie on the list. If he adds some rebounding or assist numbers, and cut down the turnovers, he could have a really impressive future.
Michael - that's a complete blow-up of the team. I don't think it's necessary, and blowing up a successful team almost always takes a few years to fix. I'm not sure Shaq, Giddens/Moore, Stojakovic, Hamilton and Paul is a starting lineup that can get us in the playoffs, either.
Shaq, 70% Amare-30% Amundsun, Hill, Richardson, and Nash couldn't.
www.hornets247.com #2
joe
05/29/09 12:21 PM
Hopefully through the draft we could pick up dejuan blair who will rebound no doubt about it at all
And even though i know its a long shot to happen if peja does accept a buyout and comes back for a much lower contract that could give us a lot of money to work with, get pargo back becasuse he played pretty well over in europe (look at his adjusted stats over at draftexpress), and with some of the leftover money try as hard as we can to get anderson because he is just a poor mans chandler, a shot blocking/ferocious rebounding big whos offensive game is usually limited to dunks, and on the bench i think if we played wright at the two and put pargo at the 1 we could be scary athletic and very good defensively, and we would imporve on the offensive side if wright worked on his jumper in chicago like he said he was
#3
Ryan Schwan
05/29/09 12:45 PM
There won't be a buyout. Peja is guaranteed the cash - and buyouts in the NBA usually only save the team doing the buyout a million or two. That would mean the Hornets would still have a 13 Million dollar salary on their books, and not even a player playing for that much cash. That's not gonna hapen.
I'd love to get Dejuan Blair. I bet he goes in the 10-15 range though. We'll probably get someone like BJ Mullens, or maybe Chase Budinger.
www.hornets247.com #4
Mark
05/29/09 01:03 PM
Although Posey was not a mistake of a signing in my opinion (the contract itself was, however), our selling of the draft pick was. Coach Scott doesn't seem to like using non-tried and true players, but at the same time it's obvious we need some young talent, maybe even to prep for the future.
And while this may be more coaching changes, we need some active players. Sure we're trying for a more Spurs gameplan (slowly and methodically pick apart the other team), but coach Scott is nowhere near Popovich status (I don't really think any coach is, to his credit). Only players we got that are really active are CP, CFRM, and JuJu*.
Do you guys remember that special they had on NBA.com regarding the Hornets' conditioning (20 suicides in 20 minutes)? Apparently that goes for waste, since most our players stand around anyway.
www.dogpile.com/ #5
michael
05/29/09 02:29 PM
Agree to disagree Ryan. Cleveland had a "blowup trade" just a short time ago, basically trading their key players except LBJ and Z and did well afterward. I think that team definately makes the playoffs but even if they dont, they sell out every game and we get a lottery pick to package in a deal or get another cheap role player.
This trade also allows a lot of minutes for guyslike JuJu and our incoming rookie so that by the time we get tow B type scorers, these guys have some experience and are solid players. Sorry to say but we have to blow it up. Peja, TC, and Posey are worthless to this team, all for different reason, and West has more trade value than he ever will and can get the rebuilding started.
#6
Dodgerblue15
05/29/09 04:36 PM
It's too bad the Chandler trade didn't go down. That would have helped the team a lot with cap flexibility. You could've made a run at Martin Gorcat and/or Birdman Chris Anderson.
Even still, a guy like Ike Diogu might be a good fit. He's undersized, so his price will probably remain low, but he's great at scoring on the block. Zaza Pachulia? Not flashy, but gritty and better than people think.
As for the shooting guard problem, he might be a little too big to play the 2, but a guy like Rodney Carney has athleticism, youth and the ability to shoot the three. There's also Shannon Brown, who we Lakers fans call ShanWOW. I'd hate to see him go and his point guard abilities are a little iffy, but he could be a value signing if the Lakers don't offer him a deal. Von Wafer maybe? He's a bit of a headcase, but the new way to spell "instant offense" is Von Wafer. Anthony Parker's got some handles and can shoot and play decent enough D, but he's pushing 35.
I dunno, the Hornets are strapped for cash and Peja and Posey are eating away a large chunk of salary that they are not earning. Plus, with the lenght of their contracts, they're both impossible to move.
I agree with Michael. This team needs to start over, though that would mean doing the impossible and trading Tyson Chandler--who made the Thunder look brilliant by undergoing ankle and toe surgery this week--Posey, who has too many years, and Peja who is an injury risk, has too many years AND isn't good enough to warrant half of his contract dollars.
The worst part is that I highly doubt there is a market for David West. He doesn't scream missing piece for any team I can think of that needs a missing piece. On the other hand, he's not a building block seeing as how he's turning 29 next year.
westcoastslant.blogspot.com #7
Dodgerblue15
05/29/09 04:38 PM
Seems the Hornets are kind of screwed. If only this team had the "B+" scoring option of a Kobe Bryant...
westcoastslant.blogspot.com #8
joe
05/29/09 05:36 PM
OK i got a pretty good trade idea
Antonio Daniels to Blazers for Sergio Rodriguez and their early 2nd round pick
Blazers get an accomplished verteran who has a ring and knows what it takes to be a champion, a pass first point guard which fits what they look for in points, hes a character guy who can mesh with what looks to be everyone (something portland wants more and more to get over the jailblazers era even more), Rodriguez is also in McMillians doghouse and upset and probably ruinging their chemistry, and most importantly daniels is 6 mil comin off the books and kevin pritchard wants that kind of money, and for the 2nd rounder they have so many picks they want to get rid of some to save money
Hornets save alot of money, they get a spark plug young point who can make plays, they also get another draft pick and over at draft express it says with that pcik the blazers were most likely to pick up marcus thornton, so we can get him while also using our earlier pick to get a big like Dejuan Blair
(Anyway Kevin Pritchard is smart and might use Daniels as another trade peice later)
Havent had a chance to try the trade machine yet to see if the money works out bit if it does thoughts???
#9
joe
05/29/09 05:52 PM
my bad nbadraft.net said thornton will most likely be available, and to everyone who thinks than blair will be gone by 21 how about Gani Lawai a 6-9 pf who is a solid low post scorer and defender, while also a pretty good defender
#10
Mark
05/29/09 08:32 PM
I'm with DodgerBlue on Ike Diogu, if only for the reason that I went to high school with him. He's a good offensive option, though is foul prone and, as said, undersized. Haven't seen him in the league for awhile (very much a bench player), but he seems to do well when given minutes, albeit on a crap team against other crap teams.
www.dogpile.com/ #11
saltandcarbon
05/29/09 11:14 PM
I love Zaza, although I'd suspect the Hawks are willing to pay a premium to stay with a group he obviously works well with (especially if they can find a centre to move Horford to the 4, since Zaza can back up either spot).
I'm big on Sergio as well.
#12
emir
05/29/09 11:52 PM
hornets talking to pargo again so he might come back which would definatly improve our team in terms of another ball handler
#13
Mark
05/30/09 12:29 AM
Don't forget Pargo's a year older, and back from an injury. While he worked well with us last year, I wouldn't be too surprised if his production declines.
www.dogpile.com/ #14
BeesGivingEffort
05/30/09 03:20 AM
Couple things.
A) Scottie Pippen was always an A player including the first three peat. The man made the NBA's top 50. You don't make that list unless you are something special.
B) I would love Marcus Thornton. Again, draft guys that have already proven themselves on the college level. Doesn't seem that hard to me. This is instant offense off the bench and after watching about a dozen LSU games this season, this guy looks to be a very Ben Gordon-esque player with a little more athleticism and PG ability. Oh, and drafting local boys makes everyone happy.
C) Don't get me started on Rodney Carney. That was the worst draft night of my life. I'm sitting there praying they snag him at 11. They pass. OK. He slides past 12 and we are there at 13 and we took Cedric Simmons. I can't begin to explain the plethora of cursewords coming out of my mouth.
D) Again with the Posey dogging. Did you read the market value segment at all? Do you watch Hornets games? You think you can find a lockdown defender that has a decent offense and rebounds the ball for 6million please throw out some names. Could keep going on intangibles and competitiveness but I won't
#15
nikkoewan
05/30/09 04:05 AM
totally agree. now i can see posey's value. i can see him go at it for 2 more years, then decline sharply on the third. but on the last year( signed to for years, 1 year now then the described scenario), he will become a huge expiring contract.
#16
Ryan Schwan
05/30/09 10:12 AM
Scottie Pippen was always a an exceptional player, HornetsGoneSoft, but his offensive game actually took a while to develop. He was a Class A offensive player in the last year of the first three championships, but the first two he wasn't. They needed Grant's scoring. Defensively, Pippen was always one of the best in the league. By a long way.
I agree the Hilton Armstrong-Cedric Simmons draft was pretty horrendous. It was a classic case of drafting for need instead of talent and being screwed by it. I'm not a huge fan of Rod Carney myself, since he hasn't really broken out at all in his three years in the league, and you'd expect some improvement if it was coming. Right now, he's a below average shooter with below average ballhandling and better than average defense.
At least he'll run in the open court, I guess.
www.hornets247.com #17
bigindian15
05/30/09 01:32 PM
@DodgerBlue: I think a lot of teams would love David West. Especially in the East, because their simply aren't a lot of dominant post players there, and West is dominant at times. He's also a late game player and always seems to turn it up. Teams like Chicago and Detroit would love him
#18
bigindian15
05/30/09 01:36 PM
@joe: why would the Blazers ever do that trade? Daniels may have veteran savvy, but they love Rodriguez and Daniels just isn't good enough for them to give up that much. The expiring contract would be valuable, but the Blazers aren't cash strapped, so I'm not sure they would be crazy about that deal
#19
joe
05/30/09 01:57 PM
@bigindian15: rodriguez has been a problem for the blazers, he has been voicing his opinion on his role on the team and has not been happy about it, calling out mcmillian a few times I think. Blazers don't want anyone who can hurt their chemistry and for the most part they don't need a young point theyneed to develop as bayless is already getting ready to take over that role. And while that may mean that the blazers don't need daniels he is a very good trade piece and with pritchard being the trade savvy gm he is I could see him packaging daniels outlaw and a draft pick to get something big in return.
Also the blazers aren't cash strapped now but when it's time to sign their players to big contracts they will be
All signs point to this trade being a plus for both teams
#20
BeesGivingEffort
05/30/09 05:14 PM
I have about 100 taped games from the 91-93 Bulls. Michael and Scottie as a duo were one scary fricking team (on O and D) is all I'm saying. They ran the floor exceptionally well. They were both incredibly effective at going to the basket. Scottie shot the 3 Ball poorly and FT below average but the rest of his offensive game, even early 91ish, was pretty polished as evidenced by his 50% shooting. Watching those two run the floor together on fast breaks was a thing of beauty. Side note. People tend to forget the amount of hops Scottie had. He did the free throw line jump with his toes on the line with ease. To this day, I think the only duo in history that could compete with those two is Kobe and Shaq and that's only because Shaq is the only bigman I don't think Scottie could body up to and defend.
Anyways, I'm done. I had to defend those Bulls as it was pretty impossible not to be a fan of something that exciting and minus CP3, SP will go down as my second favorite player in NBA history.
#21
BeesGivingEffort
05/30/09 05:19 PM
And on Carney, I haven't been that impressed with him either but I'd still EASILY take him over either of those 2 scrubs we drafted. Is Cedric Simmons even in the league anymore? You can't tell me you would rather Devin Brown over Carney. There is still a ton of NBA talent in that kid and you never know what someone like CP3 could bring out of him.
#22
bigindian15
05/30/09 05:43 PM
@Joe: I didn't know he had problems with the org, but I still kinda think Rodriguez is a better trade piece than Daniels, if they just want a better piece.
The more I think about it, getting Rip Hamilton is a good idea. I still think West+Peja for Prince+Hamilton, and maybe including Julian Wright and Amir Johnson/Aron Afflalo/Jason Maxiell, would work for both teams. I think the Pistons would do it just to get rid of the long term contracts of Rip and Tayshaun, while I think it instantly makes us a lot better and fills all of our needs (according to above), especially if we somehow get Maxiell.
Another idea (somehow we gotta get Bower working on this): three team deal with Detroit and Chicago, we somehow end up with Ty Thomas, Prince, and Hamilton. Can anyone think of something like that that doesn't involve us giving up Chandler?
Also, if Cleveland loses tonight (or game 7), I think the whole scenario changes because they will probably overreact and overpay to get a legit #2 to LeBron to try to get a title before he leaves (or to entice him to stay). David West, or maybe Posey to shore up their crappy bench perhaps?
#23
Ryan Schwan
05/30/09 10:03 PM
I've seen a lot of suggestions about trades with the Pistons - but I have no desire to get Hamilton. He declined this year, and here's the problem. Most sites haven't been updated with the fact that he's signed a three year extension worth 34 million. He's 31, and is under contract until he's 35. I have a feeling he's going to struggle next year to be worth more than 10 mil a season, much less the following three.
I also keep seeing you guys propose trades of a big man - West - for small players. Does that mean you don't agree that our biggest problem is our lack of big men?
www.hornets247.com #24
joe
05/30/09 10:52 PM
@bigindian15: your right that in most situations rodriguez would be a better peice but you got to think in this economy alot of teams are just looking for that expiring contract and in those cases it pushes daniels over the edge, but for other teams yeah rodriguez would be a better peice
#25
bigindian15
05/31/09 01:11 AM
@Ryan: I think the biggest problem was Tyson's injury just because he makes our interior go. We do need a backup big, but he doesn't have to be spectacular. We do really need another guy in the backcourt to take pressure of CP so he doesn't have to make a play every single time down the court
I'm kinda afraid of Hamilton's age too, but here are my reasons why I think he'll be ok:
1) He declined, but he still wasn't really bad. 18.3 ppg (up from previous year), 45% shooting isn't terrible
2) He was injured and juggled between starting and bench if you remember because of the AI situation
3) Didn't have stable point guard situations with Stuckey being vastly overrated as the next D wade (lmao)
4) Was unhappy because Billups got traded and he was stuck with AI
5) The Pistons really sucked ass this year, and he suffered from having basically no other real scoring options except for AI (cancer anyone?)
#26
BeesGivingEffort
05/31/09 01:40 AM
I'm with Ryan. Easily our biggest problem in the playoffs was our post production on D and O. Youre trading our second best player and our ONLY player worthy of the name big man on our team for wings, a position we are already overcrowded at. We have to come out with another big man in a trade with West, even if it is only an 8th man. Don't count out Detroit being interested in Chandler also. Anyways.
Our starting lineup for 2009-2010 will be Chris Paul, Wright, Rasual, West, Shaq with Pargo, Posey and...if we are lucky Blair or Thornton coming off the bench along with another signed FA depending on which position we take at #21. You're welcome to laugh at me as I think this is incredibly silly too but that's my May 31st prediction. This doesn't exactly address our need for a true SG but having the Shaq Daddy down low will take considerable amounts of pressure off David and CP3. Upside aside, our season resting on an aging Shaquille O' Neal scares the crap out of me but I think with that lineup healthy we could easily win a title with him. You may be wondering how the Hornets end up with Shaq and his massive but expiring contract and the only way I see that happening is through Chandler and Peja and hopefully not but maybe our 1st round pick for Shaq.
Not gonna lie, I haven't done the research to back that lineup up but that's what I'm going to go with.
#27
Mark
05/31/09 01:10 PM
Anybody watching the Magic? Their successes are twofold: shot-takers, and play-makers. Unfortunately, I recall our team being more hesitant to shoot their shots toward the end of the season (JuJu, Predrag), and our only play makers are CP and DX. Of course it helps when you have Dwight 'out-of-wedlock' Howard commanding the post (so the weak-help would be another wing), but most of their line-ups seem to be able to drive quite well. Of course, different team different plan, but they're a live-by-the-jumpshot team. We'll see if they can push at most 7 games more with all these made long-range bombs.
Anyway, I think we need to go younger. Most the proposed trades makes us go older. You guys think it's a bigger risk trading for unestablished talent than aging declining players?
Ryan: In your opinion, should drafts be approached for talent over need? I know there have been bad, bad drafts with need (Sam Bowie, Oden, I guess Darko), but it's much harder to address the need and get a good talent. Granted our team needs pretty much anything, even a PG to backup CP.
www.dogpile.com/ #28
bigindian15
05/31/09 01:30 PM
Dwight 'out-of-wedlock' Howard
What the hell does that mean? lol
The key to the Magic winning is that they are insanely versatile. Their big 3 - Howard, Turkoglu, and Rashard Lewis. Howard is the most dominant big man and is really coming out in these playoffs. Turkoglu and Lewis are both great shooters with great range, and have the skill to drive and create plays like guards, and they are both decent rebounders and are 6'10" so they can really guard most guys from the 2-4 positions. Conversely, it's hard for any one guy to guard either of them, let alone both. The Cavs had no answer, because LeBron could only guard one of them and the other could take over. The Lakers will have the same problem, with Odom guarding one, and either Ariza or Kobe will have to guard the other because Gasol is just too slow to stay with them. And we all get to watch Dwight Howard murder Andrew Bynum down low. Merry Christmas :D
To replace the pf situation, I would love to somehow get tyrus thomas from the bulls, becuase I think he's a lot like Chandler in that he needs a change in scenery and playing with CP would really blossom his game, and he could still run the pick and pop/roll with cp. He's also a better defender than West, and if we had him, we could at least run some
#29
Ryan Schwan
05/31/09 01:57 PM
Interestingly enough, bigindian, I was just poking around at a Bulls site - trying to get ideas of players who may be out of favor with their teams - and there was a bit written about Tyrus Thomas.
He was the 4th worst shooter in the league from outside the paint. Unfortunately, unlike Ron Artest, Josh Smith and Baron Davis, who were worse then him, he took 53% of his shots from there. The other three took about 33% of their shots from there.
The conclusion of the article:
"Which basically means he spent more than half of his time doing something he’s terrible at. Percentage-wise, anyway. (I understand he lights it up at practice.) Feel free to join me in shuddering and saying “gak.”"
http://bullsbythehorns.com/?p=828
www.hornets247.com #30
Mark
05/31/09 02:50 PM
bigindian: haha... uhh well basically Dwight was extremely religious entering the league ("I want to put the cross on the NBA logo" type of quotations), which I very much respect, but as with many athletes he fell for the temptations of a certain Orlando Magic/Miami Heat cheerleader, which resulted in the birth of his firstborn out of wedlock. This *coincidentally* happened when I stopped hearing Dwight testifying. Yes yes forgive the sinner, but I think people should be more sincere if they're preaching: none of that "do as I say, not as I do." With that said, you gotta hand it to A.C. Green for his dedication regarding said subject. And I guess Charles Barkley, for his "I am not a role model" campaign with Nike.
hahaha... aaanyway: versatility. I suppose that's the thing I wanted from our players, but most of our players are relegated to one strict MO, incapable of undertaking multiple roles. Which is why I still want JuJu cause he seems to have that potential.
www.dogpile.com/ #31
420ftJesus
05/31/09 05:00 PM
I think we need to give D West a rest. So I suppose we need a functional backup for him. I think AD and the 2 boys would look a little better with couple more defensive rebounds and a couple more baskets per game, plus it would give D and CP a longer break, so you get a little more than the direct effects with this one.
If it can be done.
And if it works.
#32
My Swag, I surf....LoL
05/31/09 08:30 PM
The Bugs made a dumb move trading the 27th pick last year when they could've had a rookie who could contribute immediately like Kyle Weaver, Darrell Arthur, LR Moute, DeAndre Jordan, CDR etc. Now they're stuck with a pick in a weaker draft pool especially in their areas of need & where they're picking on the board.Outside of CP3 & West who were no-brainers for them,(jury is still out on JuJu) the Hornets have drafted horribly for years.And if youth is the direction they're going it sure as hell isn't going to be fixed this offseason. Best case scenario is Bower convinces Pargo to come back,they find cheap but decent backup big like Stromile Swift and everyone stays healthy.Or they could move some players in order to sign a player like Jamal Crawford, who would fit perfectly in New Orleans.
#33
bigindian15
05/31/09 08:57 PM
@Ryan: Gak
@Mark: meh, whatever, it's not like he's the only guy in the NBA to do that. Even not in the NBA, there are plenty of people in the world who preach some type of religion and do similar acts. But that's a discussion for a different place lol
The reason I think we should trade West of all people is that he has the highest value of all our guys (except CP) and, in my opinion, he was the source of a lot our problems. Lackadaisical defense, poor rebounding, nonstop bitching to the refs, getting pissed off and committing dumb fouls, not opening it up and pushing the ball, etc. He also drove me crazy because for some reason he seemed to pass up the wide open 17 footer a lot this season, instead choosing to drive and get a charge or clank an awkward runner. He also is just not athletic. He can't jump, like, at all, and he can't really run the floor, which really hurts our transition game and his rebounding. With guys like CP, Tyson, and Julian, we should be able to run at least some of the time (like the Nets did when Byron was coach there), but he definitely hinders us. Also, he's half of our offense. When he's still huffing down the court, we really can't operate because CP can be triple teamed because West's guy usually beats him down the court and is already operating on defense while West is still chugging along after bitching at the ref. He absolutely drove me crazy this season, and I think it would be better to build around Tyson, whom we know gives full effort and definitely controls the paint in the way few guys do when he's healthy.
#34
bigindian15
05/31/09 09:19 PM
http://games.espn.go.com/nba/tradeMachine?tradeId=nunexq
Thoughts?
#35
Mark
05/31/09 09:39 PM
bigindian: I like that trade, but I don't think the 76ers want or need an ailing, aging Predrag, especially at that price (I didn't follow Iggy's team, so I don't know their needs). They could probably get something better with Dalembert.
I wouldn't build around CFRM and CP, UNLESS Coach Scott limits CFRM's minutes. As a huge guy with some injury problems, his playing style is prone to injury and with this league, I don't trust his body enough to warrant too many minutes. Yes, we desperately need him, but I think we should try to ease him to ~31 minutes a night (especially since Sean Marks is effective in a pinch). Of course, this is dependent on upgrading the bench, so that probably won't happen.
Hope we'll actually use our draft pick this year... y'hear us management?
www.dogpile.com/ #36
bigindian15
05/31/09 11:57 PM
Yeah, I know it sounds kinda stupid for the Sixers, but consider:
1) Philly was dead last in 3-point shooting this season, and Peja is one of the best of all time, and he has to be defended even if he's cold (like this season - he still spread the floor for other guys)
2) Their contracts are equally terrible
3) I think they have to be in win-now mode. I don't think they can, but they really need to while Brand is still in his "prime," because he has maybe the worst contract in the league right now and won't be tradeable until his final year
4) Philly has the worst fans ever (next to the Lakers, of course), and if the team is bad, their young guys are gonna get pissed and demand a trade or just not re-sign. Think about AI: he busted his ass year after year carrying that team, even to the finals, and the fans still gave him crap all the time.
5) Dalembert already wanted out, and he's been a disappointment since he signed the new contract
I dunno if they could get something better. Most teams would want a legit starter or all star for that kind of price tag, especially because it doesn't expire next year. The Hornets are a special case because they don't really need a starting center, and would be willing to pay him because they're already stuck with Peja's salary anyway.
Also, I'm not sure we could call his style "prone to injury" yet. Lots of guys play his way. This year was his first major injury in the last 5 years. He's still young. He's not in Yao territory yet, who gets injured every year. I'm not sure limiting Tyson's minutes is really the right thing to do right now.
Also, Marks is cool and all, but not good enough for 18 minutes a night like we played him at time this season. If he's our backup big, we aren't getting out of the first round.
#37
Mark
06/01/09 03:10 PM
Agreed agreed. I'm not in touch with many other teams, so I'm not sure what management really can pull out, but that's why I'm just a fan. Haha.
Let's hope we can be shrewd and get some talent from our players if a trade goes down.
www.dogpile.com/ #38
Dodgerblue15
06/01/09 03:48 PM
From what Kelly Dwyer wrote on Ball Don't Lie, looks like the Nugs could use a low post scoring power forward. Anyone here care for Kenyon Martin and J.R. Smith for Daniels and West? I mean, that would necessitate Byron being shipped out, but a lot of people here wouldn't mind that either right?
westcoastslant.blogspot.com #39
ted
06/01/09 07:11 PM
Comments from a Blazer fan,
Your team's need for a SG really closely resmebles Portland fans desire for a PG to play alongside Roy. We want another perimeter guy who can drive the lane or get his own shot off. Playing adequate defense is also desired. Oh and we don't want to pay too much either. Sound familiar. Our only advantage is we have lots of cheap player contracts to deal or a modest amount of cap-space to sign a player.
We also want a back-up 4 who can bang. Blazers fans tend to drool over Blair as well but we've resigned ourselves that a draft day miracle is unlikely. David West is a nice piece and although you'd be trade huge contracts if you could also dump Peja maybe Brand might be a way to go at the 4. Surely Philli will be looking to deal him. He just didn't fit in that system. Cp could resurect his career. Tyrus thomas seems like a head case but he and Ben Gordon would be a good swap for West and change.
Bigindian15 and Joe,
As a Blazer fan and I think your trade of Daniels for Sergio is a possibility. However Daniels would need to be comfortable as the 3rd PG. That is the Blazers PG issue we've got 2 young guys that need development and only one gets enough minutes. Sergio has a nice game but doesn't look as good in McMillian's offense. THe Blazers need is a PG that can play meaningful minutes but would be content at the end of the bench unless needed (injury insurance). Daniels might be that guys and he played for McMillian back in Seattle (coach knows what he's getting).
As for Ike Diogu, he's not he guy you're looking for. Let me put it this way, Michael Ruffin got more meaninful minutes than Ike did in Portland. The Blazers need a Banger too.
Here's to a better run by the Hornets next season (you're the only other team in the west I could ever cheer for).
#40